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	<title>Comments on: In defense of indoctrinating children</title>
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	<link>http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/2009/12/08/in-defense-of-indoctrinating-children/</link>
	<description>Best blog name ever</description>
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		<title>By: ERIC</title>
		<link>http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/2009/12/08/in-defense-of-indoctrinating-children/comment-page-1/#comment-5842</link>
		<dc:creator>ERIC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 18:41:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/?p=892#comment-5842</guid>
		<description>I think the point Robin is trying to make is that there is no method currently in place to evaluate what &quot;correct&quot; beliefs are. And if I am mistaken, I&#039;m guessing that those in place probably aren&#039;t satisfactory or are totally subjective and unscientific.

Maybe some propaganda is good or useful in certain situations, but certainly not all of it is good. Obviously some actions we can agree are not good (rape, murder, theft) and when it comes to this message -- indoctrinate away!

But the point is, public schools, which have a near educational monopoly, shouldn&#039;t be allowed to pick what type of message they are forcing on the kids.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the point Robin is trying to make is that there is no method currently in place to evaluate what &#8220;correct&#8221; beliefs are. And if I am mistaken, I&#8217;m guessing that those in place probably aren&#8217;t satisfactory or are totally subjective and unscientific.</p>
<p>Maybe some propaganda is good or useful in certain situations, but certainly not all of it is good. Obviously some actions we can agree are not good (rape, murder, theft) and when it comes to this message &#8212; indoctrinate away!</p>
<p>But the point is, public schools, which have a near educational monopoly, shouldn&#8217;t be allowed to pick what type of message they are forcing on the kids.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/2009/12/08/in-defense-of-indoctrinating-children/comment-page-1/#comment-5838</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Dec 2009 13:27:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/?p=892#comment-5838</guid>
		<description>I spent most of the noughties in public schools.

The propaganda is not pro-American. I personally experienced anti-colonialist guilt-tripping, units on the horrors of the industrial revolution, and perpetual reminders of American crimes against the Native Americans. History lessons equated illiterate and authoritarian cultures with liberal democracies.

The details, however, are irrelevant to over 90% of students, who don&#039;t pay attention, don&#039;t care about &quot;political discourse&quot;, and get their information from pop culture.

Indoctrination has displaced every other objective that schools might pursue, so for the majority, it just means that they are exposed to a decade of useless misinformation that wouldn&#039;t help them (or society) even if they could understand it.
I lived this reality: an aimless curriculum, a total lack of clear objectives, and a choking bureacracy consuming half the funding. 

The frustration and social chaos of the public schools spawn extremist politics and authoritarian street gangs. They do not care about democratic values. They will sooner kick your head in than &quot;engage in political discourse.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I spent most of the noughties in public schools.</p>
<p>The propaganda is not pro-American. I personally experienced anti-colonialist guilt-tripping, units on the horrors of the industrial revolution, and perpetual reminders of American crimes against the Native Americans. History lessons equated illiterate and authoritarian cultures with liberal democracies.</p>
<p>The details, however, are irrelevant to over 90% of students, who don&#8217;t pay attention, don&#8217;t care about &#8220;political discourse&#8221;, and get their information from pop culture.</p>
<p>Indoctrination has displaced every other objective that schools might pursue, so for the majority, it just means that they are exposed to a decade of useless misinformation that wouldn&#8217;t help them (or society) even if they could understand it.<br />
I lived this reality: an aimless curriculum, a total lack of clear objectives, and a choking bureacracy consuming half the funding. </p>
<p>The frustration and social chaos of the public schools spawn extremist politics and authoritarian street gangs. They do not care about democratic values. They will sooner kick your head in than &#8220;engage in political discourse.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: CannibalSmith</title>
		<link>http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/2009/12/08/in-defense-of-indoctrinating-children/comment-page-1/#comment-5837</link>
		<dc:creator>CannibalSmith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Dec 2009 11:36:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/?p=892#comment-5837</guid>
		<description>This reminds me of the GPL vs BSD license debate. Is it more or less freedom if you&#039;re forbidden to forfeit it? Or, is it more or less free speech if you may not speak against free speech?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This reminds me of the GPL vs BSD license debate. Is it more or less freedom if you&#8217;re forbidden to forfeit it? Or, is it more or less free speech if you may not speak against free speech?</p>
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		<title>By: Robin Hanson</title>
		<link>http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/2009/12/08/in-defense-of-indoctrinating-children/comment-page-1/#comment-5834</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Hanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Dec 2009 18:17:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/?p=892#comment-5834</guid>
		<description>But public school *is* an enormous violation of the spirit of free speech and political dissent.  Without them we&#039;d have far more variance in beliefs, regardless of official laws.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But public school *is* an enormous violation of the spirit of free speech and political dissent.  Without them we&#8217;d have far more variance in beliefs, regardless of official laws.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Hallquist</title>
		<link>http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/2009/12/08/in-defense-of-indoctrinating-children/comment-page-1/#comment-5833</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Hallquist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Dec 2009 18:13:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/?p=892#comment-5833</guid>
		<description>For one thing, without our current educational curricula there would be almost zero popular support for Supreme Court decisions protecting political dissent. Popular support for free speech is worryingly shaky as it is, I&#039;d hate to know where that would be if most Americans hadn&#039;t had it drilled into them from a young age that that is a basic American value.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For one thing, without our current educational curricula there would be almost zero popular support for Supreme Court decisions protecting political dissent. Popular support for free speech is worryingly shaky as it is, I&#8217;d hate to know where that would be if most Americans hadn&#8217;t had it drilled into them from a young age that that is a basic American value.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin Hanson</title>
		<link>http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/2009/12/08/in-defense-of-indoctrinating-children/comment-page-1/#comment-5832</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Hanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Dec 2009 04:23:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncrediblehallq.net/?p=892#comment-5832</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not at all convinced that a knee-jerk &quot;yay democracy&quot; attitude is good for society.  What is your basis for thinking that our propaganda actually helps us rather than hurts us?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not at all convinced that a knee-jerk &#8220;yay democracy&#8221; attitude is good for society.  What is your basis for thinking that our propaganda actually helps us rather than hurts us?</p>
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